Episode #72 Outdated Sales Tactics Will Destroy Your Business in 2025! How to Survive? ft. Lindsay Cordell

Lindsay, a partner and head of GTM advisory, is a practitioner turned analyst who studies best practices and trends in Go-to-Market and develops actionable models and blueprints for our clients. She has held both practitioner and leadership roles in almost every aspect of Go-to-Market, including Product, Marketing, Sales, Revenue Operations, and Enablement for several Fortune 500 companies, including AT&T, Hearst, and Cox. She most recently ran the GTM Center of Excellence for the Account-Based Marketing Platform Solution Terminus.

Lindsay covers a lot in this episode, with some of the key takeaways being:

1. Transformational Shift in Go-To-Market Strategies: Post-November 2022, businesses need to revise their go-to-market strategies focusing more on first-party data rather than relying solely on third-party intent data.

2. Pipeline Development and Sales Enablement: Organizations excelling in pipeline development are rethinking their marketing qualified leads (MQL) approach, adapting to a more intricate B2B sales landscape.

3. AI Integration in Sales: The effective use of AI can streamline sales processes and reduce bias, but the human touch is essential for closing deals.

4. Dynamic Market Awareness: Continuous assessment of market conditions and buyer behavior is crucial for strategic adjustments in business operations and sales efforts.

Follow Lindsay: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lindsaycordell/

PS - huge shout out to Sendoso for sponsoring our show.

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Transcript

00:00 tell me the whole story tell me from the
00:02 minute that op became a sales qualified
00:05 opportunity tell me about the sad part
00:08 tell it to me like a movie and if they
00:10 can articulate that to me that shows
00:12 that they're really invested in this
00:14 process that it takes to draw somebody
00:16 over the line if they can't articulate
00:18 it to me that to me says that they've
00:20 been living in a sales
00:27 machine welcome back to another episode
00:29 of the revenue you reimagine podcast
01:32 while this is not going to drop on
01:33 Halloween we are recording on Halloween
01:37 we have a very special guest with us
01:39 today we have Lindsey Cordell who is
01:41 currently a partner at GTM Partners
01:43 which we'll talk about who is a partner
01:46 of Revenue reimagined whole lot of
01:48 partner former VP of enablement and
01:50 chief of staff at Terminus an expert in
01:52 all things go to market one of our go-to
01:55 resources and someone that we are stoked
01:57 to have a chance to chat with for a
01:58 little bit Lindsay thanks for joining us
01:00 oh my goodness so thank thank you so
01:02 much for having me it's an honor I love
01:04 I love that we get are happy to have you
01:06 here it it is less time I have to spend
01:08 with Dale alone see he he just doesn't
01:10 let me talk so this is this is part for
01:12 the course but uh it is what it is uh
01:16 cool L you guys are the best comedy
01:19 routine in sales leadership available
01:22 right now I don't know if I want to be
01:24 referred to as a comedy routine but I'll
01:26 take
01:27 it Adam's definitely funny so we we
01:30 could start there um looks aren't
02:33 everything we're super excited to uh to
02:35 have you on the show and one of the
02:37 things like we've been talking for such
02:39 a long time and I know you're an
02:41 operational Maven um I think what I'd
02:44 like to start the conver the the
02:46 conversation with today is from your
02:49 perspective you've done a lot with
02:51 Terminus now going go to market Partners
02:54 where are people really dropping the
02:56 ball when it comes to like operational
02:59 excellence in the go to market
02:01 space yeah so I think first of all I
02:05 just I've been laying it out on the line
02:06 a lot lately especially if you work in
02:09 technology or high-tech
02:12 software um I mean I think our lives
02:14 changed in November of 2022 like we talk
02:17 a lot about covid and the boom after
02:19 covid but the Fallout after the boom
02:22 after covid I think really change the
02:24 game in terms of what we should be
02:27 tracking and what we should be paying
02:28 attention to I I just I think our whole
03:31 universe got turned upside down and it's
03:33 just taken a little while for us all to
03:35 accept it so first of all I think
03:38 there's a general belief that you know
03:40 we can keep going on the way we did
03:43 before and that's just not true there's
03:45 a lot more data that we should be
03:47 mobilizing in a lot bigger way it's not
03:50 enough anymore to just look at your
03:51 third party intent data I mean it's just
03:53 it's just not enough everyone's looking
03:55 at third party intent data it's not
03:56 enough to buy Apollo and have a contact
03:60 with resolution solution that will tell
03:01 you how many marketers work at IBM like
03:03 it's just not enough anymore everyone
03:05 does that and so I do think that where
03:08 people are sleeping right now is they're
03:10 not paying enough attention to their
03:11 first-party data they're not paying
03:13 enough attention to what's happening
03:14 inside of their sales Cycles they're not
03:17 listening to the new needs of their
03:19 clients under this new post 2022 life
03:24 that we're all living and they're trying
03:25 to live off of historicals that I just
03:27 don't find to be all that relevant
04:30 anymore which I think that's the big
04:33 shift that I've seen that it's taken me
04:35 a minute to come to terms with so I
04:36 judge no one but I think it's a big it's
04:38 a big difference compared to back back
04:42 when I worked at Terminus and I I helped
04:43 run revops and enablement for
04:46 sure it's it's funny it's almost like
04:48 what you're saying is nothing changes if
04:51 nothing changes and going back and doing
04:54 what might have worked excuse me in 2021
04:57 22 23 isn't going to work in the
04:00 economic environment that we're in
04:02 postco there's you know we could
04:05 certainly go down the rabbit hole work
04:07 from office work from home and what
04:08 impact that has on you know your
04:10 organization but when you talk about
04:13 like what type of signals and what type
04:15 of data to rely on where where are you
04:19 seeing let's step away from wrong but
04:22 the orgs that are doing really good
04:24 right now the orgs that are scaling the
04:26 orgs that are
04:28 growing what are they doing well that
05:31 the other people are just like either
05:33 have no clue or just refuse to embrace
05:35 the
05:36 mindset well there's there's an element
05:39 here of I think it starts with pipeline
05:41 development like it all should right
05:43 it's the people who could potentially
05:44 buy our solution um that we've been able
05:46 to get in touch with and I see the
05:49 people who have gone through the effort
05:51 to really redefine the mql as as
05:55 marketers are want to do sometimes some
05:57 of them have relabeled it the hql the
05:59 high quality
05:01 leads concept remains consistent but
05:04 it's the people who've gone and really
05:06 reset and really paid attention to the
05:09 detail of the pipeline they're
05:11 generating and then especially if you're
05:14 in a crowded Market or you're in a
05:16 complex B2B sale not assuming that a
05:20 lead or somebody's name is the same is
05:24 the same as somebody who's interested in
05:25 buying something and so the people who
05:28 have figured that out are very confident
06:31 their relationship with sales is a lot
06:33 stronger the sales team is a lot more
06:36 confident and I'll tell you what I would
06:37 rather have a confident sales team than
06:41 a lot of other positive things inside of
06:43 my organization I want a sales team that
06:45 believes that when they call this person
06:47 up that they could buy something whether
06:49 or not it's true I don't totally care
06:51 but I think there's an element here of
06:54 that's those are the guys that are
06:55 winning in my opinion the people who are
06:58 still too ambiguous about their ICP that
06:02 are their executive leadership is just
06:04 saying 5x pipeline guys 5x pipeline I
06:06 don't care how you do it I don't care
06:08 where it comes from that continued
06:10 growth at all costs let's play the
06:13 numbers game kind of approach to
06:16 pipeline those are the people that their
06:19 win rate used to be one and four 25%
06:22 conversion off of an SQL they're looking
06:24 at win rates in the 10% one in 10 deals
06:29 are winning and just imagine essentially
07:31 what that means is that your sales team
07:33 need to work two and a half times
07:36 harder than they had to before and I
07:39 don't know about you but I don't see
07:41 that ability of salespeople somehow
07:43 miraculously being able to work two and
07:45 a half times harder if you had a 25%
07:47 conversion rate three years ago and
07:49 today you're looking at a 10% conversion
07:50 rate I mean pure just like throughput is
07:54 impossible to manage at that level so I
07:57 think those have been the ones that are
07:58 winning the other people that I love
07:00 right now are the people who are very
07:02 much paying attention to their CAC and
07:04 their payback period at a SE at a
07:06 segment level not just our big numbers
07:09 not just what we're going to put in the
07:10 board deck but the people who are
07:12 looking at look Enterprise costs me this
07:15 amount of money to generate that Revenue
07:17 I get paid back within this amount of
07:19 time and the average lifetime value and
07:21 expansion looks like this I'm going to
07:24 intentionally spend more time here or
07:25 I'm going to say look if stuff comes in
07:27 great but the risk that I'm introducing
07:30 ing into the business is not something
08:31 I'm going to seek I'd rather focus on my
08:33 midmarket or velocity sales or vice
08:35 versa but it's the people who are really
08:36 paying attention to those numbers at a
08:38 segment level and legitimately have a
08:41 plan for going after that segment in the
08:43 full go to market motion I love that
08:46 it's um I want to Circle back to the
08:49 first one that you were talking about
08:50 like the 10% close rate and having
08:53 having uh sales people work two and a
08:55 half times harder to get that same deal
08:58 closed and throughput um in the process
08:01 so what we're hearing or what is being
08:03 buzzed in the market is great we'll just
08:06 use AI to do this two and a half times
08:09 more work talk to us a little bit about
08:12 the right way to use AI within your go
08:14 to market execution and like what's not
08:17 working well which is really those
08:18 people that are like we have to do two
08:20 and a half times more so we're just
08:21 going to put more into the back in
08:24 this
08:24 funnel yeah so I'm very bullish on the
08:28 use of AI across the sales cycle I mean
09:30 I've sat in enough over the years enough
09:34 meetings with us all like giving our
09:37 opinion on whether or not an email was
09:39 good or not to a prospect that quite
09:42 frankly everyone ignored as long as the
09:43 salespeople were selling and then all of
09:45 a sudden we stop selling and it's like
09:47 oh no let's all talk about our emails
09:49 for the next month and let's see if we
09:50 can improve that so I do think that
09:54 where AI can help sales people is in
09:56 those time sucks um the other place I
09:59 can see it is kind of dealing with some
09:01 of the bias I mean when you're in sales
09:04 and I mean I have been a part of the
09:07 story you have so much bias that you're
09:09 introducing into the conversation that's
09:11 so hard to weed up that's why medic is
09:14 particularly powerful because it gets
09:15 you to stop feeling the sale and get you
09:18 to just like scientifically analyze
09:20 where you're at with the sale it's very
09:22 helpful from that perspective so what
09:24 the AI can do is scientifically analyze
09:27 where you're at with this deal and help
09:29 with for for casting and help with
10:31 behaviors along those lines as well um
10:34 it's tracking things that that AE might
10:36 not decide to put into the opportunity
10:39 um so that's been really special the
10:41 other thing that AI can support and
10:43 again I feel a little guilty saying this
10:46 but I trained like I kid you not
10:49 thousands of salespeople and you know
10:51 I've always worked in ad sales so it's
10:53 been a lot of pretty
10:55 technical actions that I've been talking
10:57 about with my sales team and there are
10:60 many of them that did not grasp the
10:02 whole truth and so we had a lot of sees
10:05 that were very expensive that elongated
10:07 sales calls and so I'm very bullish on
10:09 these Ride Along solution engineer type
10:12 Bots that just know how the product
10:14 works so if the customer asks you know
10:17 does this integration do X Y and Z the
10:20 AI can immediately pull up that
10:22 information and put it it injected into
10:24 the conversation without an AE somehow
10:27 becoming a product expert in DM p s
10:30 which is what I used to try and get done
11:31 I used to try and teach my to uh
11:34 understand um dmps dmps and all ssps and
11:38 all of the other things that happened in
11:40 ad sales it was very complicated stuff
11:42 so I'm very excited about that but at
11:44 the end of the day what wins deals is
11:47 that human touch focus and if an AE has
11:52 to split that Focus across 10 active
11:56 deals while by the way also
11:58 simultaneously usually delivered in a
11:60 third of their pipeline if most man most
11:02 mandates are a third of pipeline some of
11:04 them are up to 50% these days if there's
11:06 noow strong inbound engine so we're
11:09 going to have them self Source we're
11:11 going to have them get intimate and
11:13 familiar with 10 different accounts
11:15 simultaneously full on knowing that only
11:18 one of those is going to close it's just
11:21 it's an unmanageable amount of work even
11:24 with the improvements that AI can bring
11:26 to the table I love how you talk about
11:29 the AI solution Bots and I think some of
12:30 the best technologies that I've seen not
12:32 even just on that side but even on
12:34 competitive nature right like there's
12:36 tools out there where if I'm talking to
12:38 Lindsay about Riverside which we've
12:40 record on and I bring up a competitive
12:43 you know platform boom that battle card
12:45 is going to come up and show me where we
12:47 win where we lose and what to say and
12:50 not to say that you should not train
12:52 your AES and no one needs to be a
12:54 subject matter expert and rely on the
12:55 pop-ups on the screen I I don't think
12:57 that's the case at all um but I think
12:59 that using AI tools as described can
12:03 greatly enhance um onboarding time
12:06 product knowledge uh time to Value speed
12:09 to close Etc um and that is much more
12:12 where I'd like to see ai go versus um
12:15 creating a cold email that starts with
12:17 high Lindsay I hope you're doing well um
12:19 and that is how they all start like you
12:21 could spot these AI
12:23 emails about because you delete it right
12:25 away
12:27 um so it it's yeah it's it's interesting
13:33 when you look at the orgs that you're
13:37 helping um at GTM partners and you look
13:41 at the problems people are trying to
13:44 solve other than Pipeline and I'm a big
13:47 believer that and I say it all the time
13:48 a big fat healthy pipeline solves 90ish
13:51 percent of your problems right um but
13:54 you have to get let's stay on Pipeline
13:56 you have to get that Pipeline and you
13:57 touched on this a minute ago some people
13:59 are required to you know Source 30% some
13:01 that's high as 50 what what's the ideal
13:04 ratio like how much pipeline should an
13:06 AE be responsible to go out and Hunt
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14:36 proven way to win and retain more
14:37 customers visit
14:40 sos.com I think this is one of for me
14:43 the most common issues when we're
14:45 talking about sales in general is this
14:49 excessive
14:50 oversimplification so how many AA how
14:53 many AES do I need how many accounts can
14:55 an Enterprise AE handle on average like
14:58 I can give you average numbers from my
14:01 experience all day long but the reality
14:04 is
14:06 um is the B the way that I think about
14:10 CAC is it is we're thinking return on
14:13 investment the entire time and so if I'm
14:15 paying an AE
14:18 $120,000 base with an expected OT of 240
14:21 so they've got to make the rest up in
14:23 variable comp first of all if I'm not
14:26 paying them on Pipeline the odds of them
14:28 doing that work
15:30 effectively zero zero so if I'm not
15:33 going to pay them for pipeline then I
15:35 already have set myself at a
15:36 disadvantage there part two is if if I
15:40 have the type of product where there's
15:42 product Market fit and it's a matter of
15:45 you know a thousand people could buy
15:47 this product today I need to get in
15:49 touch with 25 of them it's product
15:51 Market fit and it's non-c complex
15:54 business then I would have an SDR do it
15:56 all day long I wouldn't want to pay my
15:58 $120,000
15:59 resource to do that work now when we
15:02 start tiptoeing into Niche industry
15:05 Niche Niche
15:06 technology um super um your buyer uh
15:11 your decision maker lives on the sea
15:12 level like if those are the situations
15:15 then I would be pushing into the AE role
15:18 more so whenever I'm talking to people
15:21 about should I hire SDR shouldn't I hire
15:22 sdrs what should I do with uh my AES how
15:25 much pipeline I always come back to what
15:27 does the CAC say and if we're looking at
15:30 a product Market fit $30,000 ACV product
16:34 that I could pay somebody $70,000 to
16:37 build that pipeline versus $120,000 to
16:40 pay that pipeline I would rather do that
16:42 now that assumes right that we can get
16:44 equal conversion the one reason that I
16:47 think people do push to the a is
16:49 building their own pipeline are a they
16:50 don't have confidence in their ability
16:52 to build pipeline otherwise and B I mean
16:55 the data shows that AES are three times
16:58 more likely to close self- sourced pipe
16:00 compared to given pipe but I think
16:04 that's one of those um metrics that when
16:06 we look at the aggregate well what that
16:07 says to us is oh we'll have the AES
16:10 build their own right but I think the
16:11 reality is let's maybe stop giving the
16:13 AES crudy
16:15 Pipeline and they might be a better we
16:18 might see that even out so are we really
16:21 going to assume that it's AE bias or do
16:23 we think that there might be something
16:24 bigger happening with my pipeline
16:26 development I would love to see a
16:28 normalization of self Source Pipeline
17:30 and you know marketing or SDR Source
17:34 pipeline have similar conversion rates I
17:37 would be focusing on what the heck is
17:38 happening there yeah so and that's why
17:41 and I hate because one of the things
17:43 that drives me nuts about sales is their
17:44 coin operated they seem to have we seem
17:47 to have these tropes like what a good
17:49 salesperson is and gong has done an
17:51 incredible job of giving us aggregate
17:53 data but you know I talk to salespeople
17:56 today that are like yep you know what I
17:58 keep my talk ratio down to 30% I'm
17:02 amazing I only talk for 30% of the call
17:04 so we've almost like sliced up the
17:06 process and they're not talking about
17:08 deals they've won if I ask an AE today
17:11 my favorite way of interviewing an AE by
17:13 the way is not that you asked is I asked
17:16 them tell me about a deal cycle that you
17:19 thought was totally dead on the vine and
17:22 you were able to miraculously revive it
17:25 and it just and it a great interview
17:27 that's a great interview question tell
17:29 me the whole story tell me from a minute
18:31 that op became a sales qualified
18:34 opportunity tell me about the sad part
18:36 tell it to me like a movie and if they
18:39 can articulate that to me that shows
18:41 that they're really invested in this
18:43 process that it takes to draw somebody
18:45 over the line if they can't articulate
18:47 it to me that to me says that they've
18:49 been living in a sales machine that
18:51 they're just they're just there to take
18:54 the call and to talk order takers order
18:56 takers Dale and I talk about it all the
18:58 time you're not a sales rep you're an
18:60 order taker and I you know how I feel
18:02 about order takers I think order takers
18:04 are awesome if I have a huge inbound
18:06 machine with product Market fit and a
18:08 brand that can kick butt if I have that
18:11 I'm all about them order takers because
18:13 I need it efficient I want that
18:14 conversion I'm Dale's order taker he
18:16 tells me what to do I spin it up in the
18:18 computer shoot it out to him and I do it
18:20 an efficient
18:21 machine D I love I love that for you
18:24 like I love order takers I love paying
18:26 them less I love say that I can't get
19:30 paid last Lindsay come on oh I'm never
19:32 going to hear the end of that one but
19:35 for my sophisticated AE that are
19:37 expected to run full funnel motions they
19:40 better be able to describe at least one
19:42 deal to me start to finish and if they
19:45 can't that to me as an indication that
19:46 maybe something's gon to ride there yeah
19:49 super uh I I love kind of where you went
19:52 through that process the the interview
19:54 question is is spot on um we talk a lot
19:60 about like go to market changes so
19:03 quickly is Chang like you talk about
19:05 November
19:06 23 22 something like that um what how
19:10 often should people be reviewing their
19:13 go to market strategy um I feel like
19:16 it's every three months because it's
19:17 just changing that fast but I'm curious
19:19 what your perspective is after talking
19:21 to a lot of uh
19:23 customers the way that I would think
19:25 about it is each go to market strategy
19:28 like you should know how long it will
19:30 take to come to fruition so for example
20:34 if I'm building inbound from scratch I
20:37 have 2,000 people on my website today my
20:40 primary competitor has 400,000 people on
20:42 their website today like what will it
20:45 take for me to get from 2,000 to 400,000
20:49 or even like five exit and then I would
20:52 be like do I actually have the time for
20:55 all of that to develop and then it's
20:57 maintaining your conversion rate and
20:59 then it's assessing the quality of those
20:02 conversions and it's audience management
20:04 I mean there's so much happening so if
20:06 it takes you six to nine months to
20:08 figure all of that out what we can't do
20:11 is start that project and at three
20:13 months say go to market motions not
20:15 working I'm out right so I would think
20:18 about each go to market motion that you
20:20 run so let's say you're running a vent
20:22 Le and event Le tends to be one of the
20:25 ones that gives you the most
20:27 instantaneous gratification of audience
21:31 like reception so I went to a place I
21:33 talked to a person I told my story they
21:35 nodded at me we booked a meeting like
21:37 that tends to be a lot faster and so if
21:40 I'm running an event L strategy and
21:41 let's say I go to three events in a
21:43 quarter and none of them pan out I would
21:46 be seriously reconsidering I would you
21:48 know maybe there's qualifying characters
21:50 that I'm going to the wrong events we
21:52 sent the wrong people we like you have
21:54 to be able to read what's happening as
21:57 to why there's failure so but I do think
21:00 knowing how your audience wants to
21:03 interact with you and keeping a pulse on
21:06 that I mean that should be something
21:07 that we're thinking about to your point
21:09 Dale like every three months I want to
21:11 know is the intent the same is the
21:14 interest the same is the website traffic
21:17 improving it like am I truly touching
21:19 these people and if I'm not I need to
21:22 think about where that audience is and
21:23 figure out how to get to them so I would
21:26 think almost like audience strategy
21:29 should be something you're thinking
22:30 about every 3 months but the Motions I
22:33 would be evaluating on their own motion
22:35 based timeline and so what's really
22:37 annoying too so
22:39 inbound tends to take a long time to
22:41 ramp and a lot of junk comes through
22:44 inbound but the sales Cycles are much
22:46 shorter so it feels really good the
22:48 alternative is outbound outbound it can
22:51 take a real like you can get into the
22:53 right account relatively quickly like
22:55 you know 20 emails 10 calls Facebook
22:59 connects get a warm intro use a partner
22:01 all the things that we can do in
22:02 outbound but because they're not in a
22:04 buying mode yet unless you're super
22:06 lucky that could take six to nine months
22:08 to then come to fruition in a deal
22:10 capacity so like there's length of time
22:13 of each go to market motion that is
22:16 going to affect your sales cycle link
22:18 that some of it is danger this is not
22:20 going well and some of it is like yeah I
22:22 bet because they weren't in a buying
22:24 mood and I went after them and they
22:26 never had any budget set aside and this
22:28 was never the plan to switch so of
23:30 course it's going to take longer for a
23:31 salesperson to be successful it doesn't
23:33 mean they're going to be you're not
23:34 going to get either deal from either
23:36 side but it's just
23:38 different Dale you got all that I I
23:41 wrote down tons of
23:43 stuff I ramble y'all I hope no I love it
23:47 I just want to make sure that that Dale
23:49 is actually going to apply this um I
23:52 think it's great telling all anything
23:53 you don't already know that's that's not
23:56 telling Adam a lot he doesn't know
23:00 I'm just the order taker y'all um
23:04 Lindsay 2024 is coming to an end uh 25
23:08 starting
23:09 when the Market's
23:12 changing uh there's no matter which way
23:15 things happen in a week there's going to
23:17 be political turmoil that's going to
23:18 affect everything from sales to
23:21 economics and everything in between what
23:23 do you see for 25 what's going to
23:26 continue that we're seeing now um and
23:28 what's
24:30 change so first of all I don't know
24:33 about you H but I get kind of sad at the
24:35 end of a fiscal year at the end of a
24:38 calendar year I think it's just years
24:39 and years of sales of like all right
24:42 guys this is it like quarters end and
24:45 you're a little bit sad but you've
24:46 always got a little bit more but this is
24:47 the end of the show for 2024 yeah which
24:50 always like tugs at my heart heart
24:51 strings a little bit are we where we
24:53 want to be did we miss by how much is it
24:55 recoverable all of those things so I
24:57 don't know if that an I don't even have
24:59 that process anymore but so many years
24:01 in revops like that's all I can think
24:02 about at this time of year the one thing
24:04 I will say is that people are
24:06 behaving strangely heading into the
24:09 election so I do expect there to be some
24:14 improvement of buyer
24:18 morale in general I think people are
24:20 very nervous they're very nervous about
24:22 what the world is going to be they've
24:23 been told by the media the world and all
24:25 the candidates too like the world will
24:27 be over if I don't the end the yeah no
24:29 matter who wins the world's going to end
25:31 the world's going to end either way so
25:33 why sell anything and why buy anything
25:34 so I do you got to get your commission
25:37 before the world ends you got to go out
25:38 on a bank I won't even be able to spend
25:40 it the inflation will ruin my life so
25:43 regardless I do think there's a lot of
25:45 anxiety in this 2024 end that I'm
25:49 hopeful will
25:51 be like subdued by the time we get
25:53 through Thanksgiving and give us the
25:55 entirety of December to finish whatever
25:57 business we want to close by the end of
25:58 2024 fingers crossed feeling hopeful um
25:02 that being said for
25:03 2025 I think the people who can calmly
25:07 and rationally look at the reality of
25:10 their current business and make smart
25:13 decisions about pipeline about Staffing
25:17 about all all of the parts of their go
25:19 to market engine I think those people
25:21 are going to do really well and they're
25:23 going to have less like wacky
25:25 interference from economic behavior
25:28 years and things like that happening I
26:31 think the people that still don't have a
26:33 plan at the end of 24 and who are
26:35 pulling up their data from 23 or 21 and
26:39 saying remember when it was remember the
26:42 way it used to be I think those are
26:44 going to be the people that continue to
26:46 struggle and then if you're struggling
26:49 in a down economy like it's not that the
26:50 economy is down but everyone's
26:52 perception is if you're struggling here
26:53 and money is not fraying up and you ran
26:56 a business model where you needed your C
26:58 round
26:59 to keep things keep the lights on you're
26:02 going to have to turn the lights off and
26:03 someone's hopefully going to buy you um
26:06 or businesses will shut down so I think
26:08 it's going to be I think 2025 you know
26:11 in my humble opinion is going to be the
26:12 year of the halves and the Have Nots
26:15 there's going to be people that are
26:16 doing really well and who are looking
26:17 around being like it's all better and
26:19 they going to be people that are really
26:21 struggling and are like fighting for
26:24 extra money to keep their businesses
26:26 open and not even sure why they're still
26:28 fighting and I think that's going to be
26:29 really tough on them so I think it'll be
27:31 2025 will be the year of the have and
27:33 the have
27:34 kns yep inter totally agree totally
27:38 agree should we should we start doing
27:41 some uh rapid fire see if Lindsay can
27:43 handle rapid fire on a
27:45 Halloween I I have no doubt that Lindsay
27:49 can handle rapid fire all right here we
27:51 go Lindsay you can't be in Tech ever
27:55 again you can't have anything to do that
27:56 has to do with tech or marketing or
27:59 sales what are you gonna
27:01 do oh my goodness
27:05 um um something with kid something with
27:08 with um college education I think I
27:10 would love to be a college professor um
27:14 I feel like I'm cheating because I'd
27:15 like to teach marketing and sales in
27:17 college but but that that's okay the the
27:20 professor I mean not that you have time
27:22 but like the professor thing you could
27:24 do like as an adjunct like you could
27:25 still do that I town I just don't have
27:29 uh I don't have a lot
28:31 of time right now but that is that is my
28:35 retirement plan I would like to go into
28:36 very cool so since it's Halloween what's
28:39 your favorite Halloween
28:41 candy Reese Reese's Cups all the way do
28:44 you steal your kids peanut butter
28:48 cups oh absolutely especially it's the
28:50 pumpkin Christmas tree those are moms
28:53 mom tags 100% I was going to I I had it
28:56 all planned to like go through Zachary's
28:57 candy tonight I to like the Reese's and
28:59 the white ones and the kid woke up with
28:00 101 fever so he will not be
28:02 trick-or-treating today although he is
28:03 begging me to medicate him and just let
28:05 him go um but yeah all all put all all
28:11 about the
28:12 Reese's um early Burger Night Owl
28:15 Lindsay normally an early
28:18 bird I will say as of late with the time
28:21 zone changes I don't know if this
28:22 impacts you guys but like my mornings
28:24 have been a little sluggish I'm looking
28:25 forward to Daylight Saving when it
28:26 doesn't get light till fraking 7:30 yeah
28:28 it's impossible to get out of bed I'm
29:31 yeah yeah but normally early bird I like
29:33 to hear the birds shping watch the
29:34 sunrise All That Jazz um what's the
29:37 first app you check when you wake up in
29:38 the
29:39 morning oh that's a good question well
29:42 I'll admit I um had to go on a Tik Tok
29:44 fast um I I i' stayed away from Tik Tock
29:48 for a long time I I did it this year and
29:50 then it had like has a career advice and
29:52 stuff on it y'all it's not just like
29:54 teenagers dancing which is cool so I was
29:58 super were excited about uh that but I
29:00 had to take it off my phone so now I'm
29:02 like suffering through Facebook
29:04 reels as a poor comparison but no I Lov
29:08 I love listening to some of my career
29:11 Idols if you will talking about the
29:13 right things to do in business I found
29:15 it very motivating to kick off the day
29:17 that way I love it what's the uh what's
29:19 the one thing you do to unwind after a
29:20 long
29:22 day uh a glass of wine and then I just
29:25 like watching my kids play so I'm still
29:28 in that like honeymoon phase where
29:30 whatever they do just to me looks
30:32 magical so it's awesome I love it let's
30:34 wrap this up dream vacation
30:38 destination um so it's kind of changed
30:43 recently so normally Europe I love
30:45 Europe I grew up in Europe came to the
30:47 us as a like competent human being when
30:50 I was 15 so I love traveling Europe but
30:52 I really have been looking at Asia and
30:56 India and getting Singapore so I'd
30:60 really love to see that side of the
30:01 world who I've only ever seen it on TV
30:03 for the most part so I'd love to see
30:05 India I love to see Singapore love to go
30:08 to Hong Kong so I'm all about southeast
30:10 Asia and Central Asia right now nice
30:13 yeah very cool my son wants to do that
30:15 as
30:15 well I did Thailand and Vietnam last
30:18 year um it was incredible didn't get to
30:20 do um Singapore but it was really cool
30:22 Lindsay thank you so much for joining us
30:25 y'all can go check out Lindsay on
30:26 LinkedIn check out GTM part ers.com
30:29 correct it's all sorts of great
31:33 information playbooks tips guides you
31:36 name it it is there um thanks for coming
31:39 and hanging out with us yeah absolutely
31:41 so teeny teeny self-plug yeah GTM
31:45 partners.com we also have a substack
31:48 every Monday um comes out and we are we
31:51 it's it's such a um sounds like a cliche
31:54 but we're trying to democratize this
31:56 information so if if you think about all
31:59 the cool models that Forester McKenzie
31:01 or Topo created we are doing the same
31:03 thing for the Here and Now 2024 soon to
31:06 be 25 so check out our Frameworks our
31:09 models I'm very hopeful that it will
31:11 help anybody in the go to market team
31:13 from product to CS to Executive
31:16 leadership run a much smoother go to
31:18 market in 2025 create some calmness back
31:20 in their businesses so please check us
31:22 out we left to we'd love to give you
31:24 some free content which not a lot of
31:26 that going there is
31:29 not awesome Lindsay thank you thanks
32:32 Lindsay oh my pleasure thank you guys oh
32:34 my gosh it's such an honor thank you so
32:35 much