Episode #97 You’re Solving the Wrong Problem — Here’s What’s Actually Broken with CEO Hannah Ajikawo

Bridge the Gap Podcast is back with a no-BS masterclass on what’s actually breaking your go-to-market strategy. This week, we’re joined by Hannah Ajikawo — award-winning GTM consultant, founder of Revenue Funnel, LinkedIn Top Voice, and, quite frankly, the person who should probably be running your company.

🚨 If you’re struggling with alignment, lead management chaos, or “just need more leads,” this one’s for you.

In this episode:
 • Why most GTM strategies collapse before they start
 • The “real” problems founders keep ignoring
 • How internal politics are silently wrecking your revenue
 • Tactical frameworks to build and scale repeatable revenue engines
 • Sprinting, scoping, and why AI is about to humble your whole org

Plus: hear Hannah’s brutally honest takes on enablement, tech debt, and the one mistake everyone makes in sales training.

Follow Hannah: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hannah-ajikawo/

PS - huge shout out to Sendoso for sponsoring our show.

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ZoomInfo is also a proud sponsor - check them out here!

🎁 Lastly, we have a gift for you! We’re tired of seeing people getting critical GTM components wrong. Need help with your ICP, Buyer Persona, and Value Prop? Tired of the shitty “resources” people “give away” to gain followers?

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Transcript

This is Bridge the Gap powered by Revenue Reimagined, the podcast where we dive into all things revenue. Each episode, we bring you the top founders and go-to-market leaders to challenge how you think about growth and help you bridge your biggest go-to-market gaps. I'm Adam Jay. And I'm Dale Zwizinski. 

As always, thanks for hanging with us. There's a million ways you can be spending your time and we're grateful for you choosing to spend it with us. Be sure to check out our newsletter if you want the show notes and tactical advice on how to bridge your GTM Gaps. Let's get to it. 

Welcome back to another episode of the Bridge the Gap podcast powered by Revenue Reimagined. We have an absolutely epic guest with us today. We have Hannah Ajikawo, who is an award-winning go-to-market consultant, founder of Revenue Funnel, where she helps B2B scale up unlike growth and optimize their revenue engines. A little fun fact, she has over 17 years of experience, is a LinkedIn top voice, a LinkedIn sales insider, a Salesforce insider, one of the 100 most powerful women in sales by demand days. I need to come up for air. HubSpot, modern sales leader and a global, she is not joining us from the U.S., a global expert in aligning sales processes with, and take note of this, everyone, because we talk about this all the time, modern buying journeys to drive sustainable growth. I mean, I feel like we could just stop there and I could drop the mic. 

Hania, thanks for joining us. It's been great, team. Thank you very much. 

It's funny, every time, and we've had a couple of weeks since we have recorded a podcast, but here in Adam, you need a hype man coming into any speaking engagement, any webinar you're doing, you need Adam in there. 

I could go back to radio. I started my career in radio and I made $6.27 an hour and realized, unless you have a syndicated morning show, you're going to make no money whatsoever. But yeah, I could intro people and I could queue up some songs. Next on Classic Rock, whatever, whatever. 

I love this. Adam the Yacht Rock guy. Okay, let's get into some go-to-market. So, you've gone through a lot of work through many organizations, doing buying journeys, but you've also worked in organizations and clients. Pick one moment in time, whether it was in your past career, clients that you've worked with, where you've seen that moment where everything is just starting to fall apart. What was going through your mind when you think you have everything and then everything's just falling apart, whether it's economically, macroeconomics, or someone, a competitor came in. Take us back to that moment where you felt like that GTM strategy that you just created that was amazing is just out of control. 

So, okay, that's pretty much every scenario I've been in. So, I would say, I'll take it back a step. So, I'm going to go to everything you said before you said the go-to-market strategy was out of control. So, it's that I just created was out of control. So, I'd say just before that, the whole reason why most things were out of control was because it was missing a go-to-market strategy. And that is almost in almost every single environment. And I say that because eight years ago, nine years ago, I didn't know what... 

I wouldn't say that I could succinctly explain anything about go-to-market strategy. We just did the stuff, right? And then you realize, oh, there's a thing that is actually a way of thinking through it. But it was just because I came out of environments where big public and trading companies, lots of process, lots of success, measure things properly, teach about business acumen, you operate in a certain way. And then you shift into startups and realize they don't quite do that. 

They just do lots of stuff. Sometimes it really works and then it doesn't. So, I failed at that because when I was getting into environments, again, before I understood the logistics behind the go-to-market strategy, I just knew some of the good things that worked. I would look at an environment and then I would be like, I saw this in my interview. 

Why am I here? And what I mean is lots of stuff that was said was going to be like... Oh, we're planning to do this. Lots of plans. It's really easy to make a plan. A plan is like... You know the list that your kids put together for Christmas? That's a plan. Yeah, well, they think it's a plan. Yeah? That's a plan. Once you write it down, it's like, it's there. You actually have to go out and do the work by... 

Hope is not a strategy? 

Hope is not a strategy. So, what I was in these environments where there's lots of stuff and it sounds good, and then you get in and you know it's after about... Usually it takes a few weeks and then that three months marked you like, this is a shite show. So, I would say that that is a consistent theme across various organizations that I've been part of or I have consulted for. 

So, I think... I agree with you, 90% of the folks that we go into, you do realize it's a shite show. And the good part, I think more recently for us, is most of the folks we're working with realize that it's a shite show. We do have the occasional ones that bring us in and we come back with like, all of these recommendations and a phased approach for doing them. 

And it's like, don't want to do that, don't want to do that, don't want to do that, don't want to do that, don't want to do that. Well, then why did you hire us? It sucks, good and bad. No one hires us because things are going well, right? 

That's just not the reality of life. But when you realize that things are going bad and you put that plan in place, what do you think... Where do you start, Hannah? Because I have founders we've spoken with who are like, it has to start with marketing. No, it has to start with sales. 

No, we have to fix our CRM. What's the biggest obstacle you run across consistently that you're like, this is where you have to start, dude, or else you ain't going anywhere? 

It's really funny because I think the first thing that people get wrong is actually understanding what the problem is. So there is actually no definite breakdown, definitive breakdown, sorry, of exactly what the problem is. 

It feels a bit off. So interestingly enough, the last four companies that I've worked with in the last few months have all been growing. Growing at a decent rate, they're actually okay. That's a problem because when things are okay, so first they're happy that they brought people in as they were doing okay, but it's like most people don't to your point, and they wait until things are completely broken. So I'd say the first thing that people often don't look at and they look at everything else is are we looking at the right things? Do we have the right problem that we're trying to solve or the right opportunity or the right challenge? 

And oftentimes it's a no. So you might see people come in and say, we need to train our sales team. So we just say, oh, we need better marketing needs. That's usually the two things, right? So it's always the sales team or marketing needs. And then it's like, oh no, you're actually targeting the wrong ITV. And then I, ooh, we didn't know that. But that's like a heavy lift. But then like, can you just train the sales team for now? 

Because we can't get into all of that business. It's like, well, that is the thing that's going to change everything. Maybe the sales team will actually be okay. So I think that is the big thing. 

People do not have alignment on the problem. And I remember when I started to work at the company in March, I remember sending a message to all of the leaders across the go-to market. So when I go and I work at the whole cross-functionally, and then products will come in for marketing everyone. And I asked the CEO, I asked strategy, marketing, sales, and I also asked the ops team, who owns this particular thing? And everybody's giving me a different answer. 

And actually some of them responded and said, oh my gosh, I don't know. That's actually not good. So when I talk about alignment in material or on podcasts, whatever, it's a real problem. People just think it's like, we don't have the same goals. I'm like, it's everything. It's so much more than just that we don't have the same revenue goal or stuff. It's just way beyond that. 

You just talked about this this morning. 

Yeah, you, sorry. One of the things that I just pulled out of what you were saying, and I don't know how to articulate this to people, but it's very difficult, is the problem they think they have is not the problem they actually have. So like you were saying, they need more top of funnel. 

Like we hear this all the time. I need more top of funnel. And then you go in and you're like, hmm, well, it seems like you have a lot of top of funnel, but no one's answering the leads that are sitting in HubSpot or they're like buried under something else. So you have multiple workflows that are kind of like challenging that process. 

So I completely relate to that. And it took us a while. And I still think we don't do it. Like, excellent is allowing space and time for the founder, the revenue leader, whoever it is to get their head around, they have the wrong problem. 

And how do you articulate? Yes, this is a symptom of the problem, but it is not the problem. And so we spend a lot of time as you do kind of going through that process and then doing an audit, like making sure that we identify it. And after we go through the audit, they're like, oh, that makes a lot of sense. 

But like at a macro level, they just know I need these or I need more revenue or I need something else. What's a moment in time where you feel like we had everything running and then it just stops? Like there was something like what would happen inside of one of your go-to-market strategies that you're running? And you felt from a consulting perspective or from a running perspective, you're like, I have it running. 

And then something interjected. And I'm assuming it's happening more now than ever because we're seeing changes super quickly. What's that one moment in time and how do you fix that? 

So an example that I can think of is everything's up and running and it's like, okay, cool. It's in flight. That's the hardest part, right? The plan was fine, but actually getting it in flight, which takes a lot of work. I don't think people realise how much work goes into this refining and rebuilding. Like there's just so much happening. But it's actually when leadership don't just let it fly. 

They don't let it run, right? They see your two days in and it's like, what's happening? What's happening here? 

What's happening there? We've got a new idea. It's like, no, no, no, no, we need the data. So the biggest thing I see is companies look at time periods and not data. 

So it's like we've had this running for two months and it's not produced as a result. And it's like, well, how many data points do we have? Two, well. 

I'll tell you something. That's not enough data to make a decision on. So I'm like, you need a combination of both. And so you can get like some kind of, you know, go to market size, typically representative sample, because we're in small organisations. We don't need to be too specific, but we need to feel like, okay, we've got enough data. But what I see is people say, we did this for a week. The team didn't, you know, they're not bought in. The marketing lead didn't do this. The site didn't convert as we expected in the site. You're just not going to see results in that time. It's just you need to give it time and data. 

How do you get them to do that? How do you get them to give you that space? Like, give me some of that space and time so I can like really get this thing humming. And how, like it's a trust proxy, right? You have a trust proxy with these leaders. 

Yeah, exactly that. You spot on with that, right? So it's a trust thing for me. So I think what happens though is we get everyone, you know, us as a, you know, as these revenue leaders, revenue consulting, as we get people really excited by what the opportunity looks like. Oh my God, when we fix this, these are all the things you'd be able to do. So now they're like, well, tomorrow, right? It's done. Like, so can, will the team start getting agents running their calls by tomorrow? Absolutely not. It needs to be done. 

Immediately. This afternoon, right? So it's a combination of that trust. Do they trust me enough to own this change? Which means we take on a lot. I don't think people realize how much stuff consultants take on. Like, what we say and we recommend stuff. Now it's like, I'm putting my faith in you. Go forth. Go forth, Hannah. 

Go forth, Adam, right? And how much of that is ultimately out of scope that we do? Because I have this conversation with founders all the time. Like, this is out of scope, but I feel such a deep commitment to making you successful. That as much as I yell at Dale for doing out of scope shit. 

Like, we need to do this because like, there's this mind, oh, you're just a consultant. You don't care. We do care deeply. Yeah. I love that you called that out. 

No, it's big time. So, yeah, man, scope goes way out the window. I'm like, the time that it's going to take for me to rescope this, I prefer to do the work and show you. And you'll be happy to give me money. Like, you'll feel bad. 

You'll be like, we have to give you more money. So that's what we want to get to. But the trust piece, that realignment of expectations is so important. 

But trusting the process. So it's the case of, I always say that this is really important. So last year we were working with a company and I kept explaining the importance of creating a narrative. So a lot of what we do is we, because we build inside very specific frameworks, we help companies to understand exactly what's being done, why it's being done, what's happening, the timeline for that. In more detail than they ever care for, but it helps my sanity. But the reason why is because you have to keep them on this journey where it's like, remember what we said, we need to do these three things before we can do that fourth thing and just stay with it. 

Because otherwise it's a bit like what's happening, where's it going? And a big part of that trust is over communicating. I give so many updates and different forms. Like a little video, a detailed report, an email, a Slack message, a presentation, same information. Because I'm like, I can't, with consulting, you can't just say something. Well, I did send you the message because you need them to read it or consume it. Like I did tell you two weeks ago, so like that's off my to-do list that we were making the change is like, now I kind of need them to make sure that they check that stuff. 

Because I don't look good by saying I told you so. You know, wind brownie points for that. So big trust, expectations, saying, and making sure that we can help them build a narrative so they know where you are on that journey. Otherwise they literally will want everything next week. 

Here's a little hack for any of the people doing the work that we're doing. We actually do three-week sprints inside of ClickUp. And we put all those activities in these three-week sprints. And like you can go as far as like using those in your executive recaps and meetings and making sure because we got stuck into a place in the beginning, scope creep, exponential problems, and we would just do the work. And then like at the end of it, you've done a lot of work, but you haven't captured it properly. And then people are like, what are you, what are we paying you X number of dollars for? And like now you have a trail and a track through the process. And it allows you to say, this is what I can accomplish in a chunk of time. And oh, by the way, you have some fire coming in on the, that you need to change. Like what needs to fall out of the scope in the three weeks worth of work? 

Yeah, yeah, like exactly the same. I mean, we are chosen platforms of sauna for now. So we do exactly the same thing, right? So running, we just run it like product development. So we have all of the, I find that's the best way. 

I love that you do that too. And I just hope people can also understand like, why isn't this happening? Well, you know, your, your, your sales team can't make the calls yet because you didn't buy the calling package. They don't, they can't make the calls. So it's like, and then people are like, oh yeah, sorry, I'm the bottleneck. So I just think this level of transparency is, is, is definitely required in order to, to kind of get them moving. 

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I was so against Sprint's for what Dale, the first six, eight months of the business. We talked about it. I'm like, I'm not a fucking developer. I'm not an engineer. I'm not a product guy. I just, like, I just have to get shit done. And what I realized, and I don't even remember honestly the first client that we said we would do it with, we did it once and I can't fathom going back. 

No way. Because to Dale's point, there's so many things we come across that come up in the middle of like, oh, well, I want you to do this now. And I want you to do this now. And I want you to do, oh, shit, dude, like there's only so many hours in the day. 

Like I can't run myself into the ground. And what we need to teach you is like, we're not going to be here forever, right? So we have to look at what's the priority. So if this is more important than that, happy to swap it out. But if not, let's add it to the next sprint. And to your point, you want me to, you know, have to train the sales team on how to make calls, but you don't have the dialer yet. 

So yeah, we can't put the cart before the horse and train them on how to do that. Yeah. You work with a shit ton of companies. And, you know, I think that while every company has differences, we tend to see a lot of the same issues across the board. When you're looking at like your current book of business or even let's just say the past 12 months, like what are the top three go to market cluster fucks that you come across that you're like, OK, I knew this was coming because like this is everyone right now. Oh man. 

Consistent theme in every single, every single thing in the last 12 months has been lead management. Like, wow, it's an issue everywhere. I would say. I would say cross. Yeah, again, cross functional alignment, but I go a bit more detailed and I'd say. And in a bit like I'm very direct. I'll just keep it real and I read the lines because I'm like, I literally can't be fake. 

I'm just going to call it out. So but what happens is there's a lot of like protection ish. Like I can't say that we need optics. We need to look good. 

You can't make us look bad. And I'm like internally. Yeah, I get it. The customers and stuff like there's certain things if you're doing it wrong, you're not going to say sorry customers. 

We're so crap at this. You be mindful of that. But internally, man, what are you doing? Like we just got to get get the stuff done and stop this. I've literally explicitly been told by a customer this is going to make us look bad to the other. I said, I said so, but it just is it is what it is like I don't I my job is at first to do a very very granular audit That's what we do. 

We do it in a very unique way to give you lots of information and this is what it shows It's not me adding a lens on it. It's just what it is So I like it's not about looking good to them. It's about delivering results They don't care good bad or ugly just deliver the result. So there's no fun in what wishy-washy Making it look pretty just deliver the fact so you can ask on them So definitely need management definitely that kind of alignment and like the politics that exist around there And I'd say the other one is Which is crazy to think but it's like people talk about tech debt I'm just like it's just the underutilization of tech Right. So I did a keynote for a very big CRM provider very recently I just asked the audience who here is unlocking all the value in their tech like at least five out of ten and they were like no Not 

what what are the colors of that CRM provider? 

But it's yeah, it's Yeah, I mean, yeah, there's a lot more to that story But but yeah, so people just don't it's so funny because you've got some companies They just they got tech everywhere They just bought tech for the fake buying tech to some sales person said this will be a good idea and also because That's a low level of entry the fat, right? What 70 bucks a month sign me up if you don't work who cares but not they I take 

those Surrounding her 

yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm just like it's fine. I'll try it out if it doesn't work fine I'm under dollars. I don't care. I just needed to check it and you get a few times got my ROI But I think yeah, there's a lot of that so so what then happens is it just creates Not this week. Yeah, that those will be the free the freaking things Yeah, 

I love the I love the perspective of the politics because I haven't heard anyone really talk about it except for us Well, I realized when I was inside of organizations I even had a hard time because it was my pipeline my team and like The first three to six months you're in a honeymoon phase and you can kind of like say what you would say as a consultant And then like after the honeymoon phase you're like, I'm afraid to say because now it's on me or like you get into this place of like ownership of it and by definition you have said or unsaid political lines that are forming inside an organization and you're in you're afraid as a Revenue leader to fracture those lines because you don't know where the cracks end up going through the organization as a as a someone from the outside we can kind of come in and say what the reality is and All the CEOs we work with are like that's what they want because they're they're missing these crap and as well as you build a culture of transparency and opera like at some point there is some Political walls or silos that get put up and so I'm glad you said that because I think that is a very difficult thing for people to run with I want to we can't yeah good if we can't 

But we can't talk we can't solve and then we just won't get things done. Yeah, so it just comes to a point where it's like listen I'm We I'm looking at the situation right now. 

I've come in to do this. I need your help to be successful I don't know why we don't just go to each other as leaders across functioning I need you to make me successful. I cannot be successful on my own It's impossible and then you find out if they're you know, they've got any sense or not sometimes they don't and then you're like Okay, you're not gonna help me be successful. Let me tell the CEO that and we make it work from there But what we don't want to do is start off if issues we've been I've been in scenarios where you get brought into do a project and The one department site well, we own the sales force and you're not coming in How old are we like five stupid 

I'll find the API and some agent and Yeah, right So what we build out a framework called the go-to-market gap so we have stabilization foundation Repeatability and scalability and and we find a lot of times in the new private fund same thing You're going in and you need to say like you got to get things like out of place where You can build on top of it like sometimes it's so fragmented You can't build on what they have or you have to modify it We were talking at an event today And one of the things that came up is like Enablement and enablement of sales team or the revenue team or whoever it is You mentioned this earlier on training, but I want to I want to give you a quote and I want to get your feedback on it What I said was if you don't enable the people you can't blame the people So we're in this firing mode of like they're not doing what we're supposed to do But what we're seeing is people aren't really On-boarded properly enabled properly so I'm just curious your perspective and what what you see when you're going at these 

organizations So I I'd agree and not agree but only only for one part so the reason why I'd agree and not agree at the same time is because Some companies are really good at setting Expectations that we have no resources to enable you We are hiring you because we believe you will know what to do and you'll get it done and So in that situation if you've joined Knowing that and then you're looking for resources and support and it's like you don't have that that's a difference Yeah, however, it's probably referring to the other scenario right? 

I just want to add that caveat so I I do agree. I think there are so many I Agree, but I still get irritated by sales people because We're in a world where they're like I now have a reason for why I'm not doing well rather than So it's just like there are like I've been in environment and I could talk from a place of reality I've been in environments where I have closed nothing for ten and a half months and being like I'd have a one-form in myself manager and be like do not call me a salesperson. I ain't sold nothing I like I'm so frustrated like I'm doing this. I'm doing that. I'm doing this like what and then I just we know that you're working hard I'm like, yeah, but what do you think I should do boss like you've been here and they're useless So I'm frustrated. We're all just being there useless. So I think that's what plays of like I empathy I get it But then not everyone has that attitude. They're like, well, you know, didn't really get that on-boarding like I expected So like I just I feel like that's the reason why so so there's there is that you know I hate the skill will thing you get my nerve a little bit because people just throw it out as like let me throw a bit Jarvin in there, but essentially You I do not feel like you have a right to tell somebody I haven't done well It particularly if they're like early stage mid-level rep and it's like they generally don't know what they're doing Like they just going with like hey I saw Morgan Ingram post on LinkedIn and he said that we should do this So I tried it and someone told me to f off. It's like, man, nothing work about buyers. 

What are you doing? 

So I think yes, and there's a lot. Oh, I can't even tell you I remember when Nick Nick Capose was making lots of content We were both out in Seattle and he said like tell me what he could advise you get the sales leaders and I was like set clear expectations You would be so surprised if By when you ask yourself in the do you think yourself people I want to think of that people need to know and I'll tell you Do you think they know that? Yes. How sure are you? Are you are you definite? And they're like, you know what? 

I don't know, you know, I get I get an add-on to that set expectations and Align with them Really like all the time. We yeah, like yeah expectations and align with them So I hear a lot of people setting expectations and they're like then they never check back in and then like a quarter later Like you didn't hit the expectation like an eye. 

It's like an eye. It's like an ICC I said at once and then I never looked at it. 

Yeah, it's just like yeah I know, you know that we have to make 20 20 calls a day Do they know how to make those calls and who's to make them to oh? I just thought they'd know that so we know you'll be surprised like I had a team right ago to market team 35 BDR I was like co-managing because they had one manager, which was crazy And I remember getting once at one time and because I developed a relationship where I'm like keep it real I remember one of the guys I was checking it self-force not great. You make you make two calls this week And what was it? Why do you think you made two calls that week? 

Please have a guess of what his answer was he didn't know who to call Oh, no, he gets worse than that. Well, I didn't get any No, we get on the list. I didn't get a little it so I just thought I think you've got delt navigator in every text Hall on earth I Just I usually get I didn't know that I could just go and just I'm like So who but you still got a deliver six SQL this month So he's just like I just didn't think that I have to do that if I didn't get the list So I just beat I'm just like so what you've been doing play Minecraft. Oh Yeah But this is the thing so when leaders are told that they're like that's crazy It's like I didn't know I have to be so literal you do. Yeah, you have to be that literal. 

I Love that. I think that is Arguably the biggest takeaway is you do have to be that literal. Yeah, Dale when I ask you to do No, I'm kidding I But but it's funny I have joke but if you think about it it is true Even when we talk to one another, I'll use an example like we're going pretty heavy on AI right now and Dale's much smarter at AI than I am And like go research it as one thing versus here is this video go to this time stamp This tells you exactly what I want you to see that's going to help you understand it from my coding side of brain that Dale has But I don't yeah, he'll validate this I message him this morning I'm like dude. Thank you for fucking sending me that that is exactly what I needed and now I totally get what we want to do So we the literal thing like we realize sometimes we have to do it with ourselves But the sales leaders or marketing leaders or success leaders like go call 20 customers and see how they like the product isn't literal What now customers? What are you asking? What are you trying to understand? Are these enterprise customers? Like you've got to be very specific 

Yeah, and I used to kick back a lot and I get sick for it But I I I don't like the general idea of if you get an SDR to join a cool that if they've booked Then they're gonna learn and ramp faster I feel like they they they learn a lot of bad practices at scale because you've got lots of reps I don't do good stuff and I'm like that's a terrible opener Why would we get SDR to do that and then the SDR does it you're like oh my god It's because they were joining that person's call so I just always kick back and say I want you to tell me why you need to join a school It's just I was gonna listen in I'm like what you're listening for I'm like go with an objective so today's pricing go and listen to how prices just that just tune into pricing forget everything else because What was happening was all this generalist stuff and then they Transition into the a while doing general stuff. There was no like real discipline around stuff and really pulling out core skill So they have to improve and I would say to leaders like stop letting me because they say it's fine as a part I get to sit back while they talk. I'm like, what did you learn? 

It was a good call why was it good I'm like what was you done? And it's so but sales leaders wouldn't always think about it. I didn't think about that I'm like, yeah, they need a reason to join like tell me why use your time wisely But there's a lot of floating and posting so you know when we're talking about like what do we see and organizations? You'll see this, you know, you join a company like there's a lot of coasters. There's a lot people just like Just kind of here. They don't they just about doing stuff But there's no like material result coming from their activities here. I'm pretty good on that. Cool. 

I love it All right, it's we're almost at time, but I got it. I got a few more as we wrap up so Hannah you're you're an astrodomist the world's changing Go to market changing arguably it's different today than it was yesterday Where's go to market heading in the next let's say six months because I think any longer than that where I'll just purely 

speculate in the next six months and I'll keep saying this over and over again is we are I'll break up a little bit so leaders Have to understand the genetic AI because it's this is going to be part of their team I think you just don't have a choice. I don't know why you don't realize you don't have choice So you have to get upskilled in the most basic way Don't need to be an expert because it's just going to form part of part of the process that you're responsible for Whether you're acquainted research or its content creation or its analysis It's just gonna be part of it and if you don't understand it you will fall behind immediately like so fast You'll you'll be embarrassed and so that's the biggest thing for me. 

It's it's The way that it's going is there's gonna be a lot more Stuff that we're not part of that we're quite used to and For some reason people think that buyers don't want to interact with robots and we've been doing it for about 15 years already In our day-to-day lives right in so many ways because it's convenient I if you can give me a result like an answer as my utility company without me having to speak to someone even better So I don't want the peasant trees. I'm pissed off. 

I don't want you to how you doing? How's your name? I don't care. Just give me what I want and reduce my bill So it's like it's the same thing for a lot of buying experiences They want to get as much as they can so I think we have to get comfortable with understanding how I'm not just generous you AI that's there But how how? Agentsic AI and AI is just everywhere. We've got it in Gemini, right? Like you you go to your calendar and it's like check this so we have to develop trust of Those things 

Because I know a lot of leaders right now that I don't click that as it's gonna tell me rubbish. I'm leaving it for now I just think if you don't use it very often You're not gonna trust it by the time it gets really complicated You're gonna be like what the hell does any of this mean and what is it doing? Where's it going? So Agentsic AI just like general AI utility is just it's just gonna smother everything we do And we have to start using it every day 

I actually would go a step further and I would say you have to get deep into it Like you have to like I don't think it's just a surfacing because the problem is it's snowballing and is changing like we think I have a question for you this but it's snowballing super quickly And if you don't get on top of it like you one is you won't be ahead of the game and two is You will be taken advantage of from the AI vendors that give you some shiny object Where you you're not gonna ask the right questions that vendor to get the right answer you're trying to solve for so That's just part of it I'm curious how often should you pressure test your go-to-market strategy? 

Oh I love that I Would say there is some Okay, so we're tracking week to week like well we have metrics right in all of these amazing CRM that we use so week to week I Need people to understand like what's working and what's not week to week Like constantly the team should understand what that means and they should come away at some point in a week where everyone understood What did we do? 

What did it produce and? What are we changing like what how does that impact moving forward? So that's like the whole thing I think there's gonna be I love this question because It's gonna be depending on company size and all those specific things, but there has to be something that you're measuring Where you're saying if like you divert the hypothesis I always say that people don't develop hypotheses enough around this strategy because you need to keep developing them so that you can Pressure test them. Otherwise, you're just pressure testing like let's go and speak to IT managers now I was like why like what's your hypothesis? 

What are you trying to develop and that's where you start the pressure test because sometimes if you get into this culture of Experimentation and then you develop a hypothesis you go test it and then that might just like expand you a little bit now There's like this other opportunity that you didn't recognize or you're now able to overcome a challenge that you didn't you just started to get You just started to sense out so I know for in my opinion. I think in a few years time It's gonna be very hard to do consulting. Yeah This kind of consulting because AI is doing so much when it be right No, people would it will say stupid stuff and it'll be very generic But you need to iron out your unique thing that you're doing as a consulting organization Even the big guys the big guys and girls right People are just like I get it like you're gonna come in and create questions for me from the answers but Harvard Business Review had something recently and it basically said it's so hard to create value now because AI makes It gives access to everything democratizing everything. So now we're going back to being creative Otherwise everything's just the same so people like that's really valuable and someone who's a bit AI like native in their thinking is like That I know that is like a free prompt search. Yep. I wasn't So that's what we're at now. See yeah, I can't remember the question but my arms are starting to 

get How often should you pressure chest and test CTM? 

Yeah, that was it very frequently based on I've also get yes 

All right, so as we wrap up we're gonna do some rapid fire We're gonna switch it back to our old rapid fire because they all like those ones better than the new ones So we'll go we'll go that route. What is the first app you check when you wake up in the morning? What's that? 

Okay, yes, that makes sense. That makes sense. Yeah Night owl or early morning Early morning. 

I'm about 5 a.m. Or 4 4 45 every single day Oh 

Four or five that's much earlier than me. I'm sick What's your favorite guilty pleasure snack 

I Don't know if it's guilty pleasure So I can eat popcorn all day I can eat like I go to the cinema to eat nachos and then I find a film that matches my Like I'm literally like I want nachos. What's on in the cinema? 

Love it. 

I love it With with the movie theater What I would call atomic cheese that you could only get that type of nacho cheese in the movie theater out of the bag And in the machine and it has a very very very distinct taste. 

Yeah, it's warm I'm like jalapeno spread them on that for me. 

You know, that's only in the US They do you cave probably has like proper cheese like we get all this synthetic synthetic stuff 

I know we get we get those the gooey bright orange cheese My son doesn't always feel the right but yeah, so anything else? Yeah, they pop popcorn and that's it That's probably it. I eat lots of eggs because I'm always training lots like seven eight eight a day. 

Yeah, I like it Okay, let's wrap it up dream vacation destination. 

Oh I I would love to do the whole like Thailand just going all around Experiencing it properly with time, but I'm trying to feel how do I convince my son to do that for like three weeks? Oh, no, it's fun. 

You so we did Thailand a couple summers ago. You need through you need three to four weeks Yeah, exactly. 

You have to right? 

Yeah, it's a great spot Hannah thank you so much for joining us for dropping so much knowledge. Where can people find you? Where could they find your company? We know we could find you on LinkedIn. We all live on the only place we live But where can they find out more about your company? 

I would say so fun fact if you go on to chat to be tea and five in the top influences in the UK I'm number one Maybe just like my version and they're like well Hannah's just had this type of tea But yeah, that's pretty fun But I'm outside of that I would say revenue funnel for credit UK. 

I create content on YouTube There's maybe a hundred viewers, but they really care about my content. So That's thank you for tuning in and then yeah, it was it's always LinkedIn always LinkedIn, but don't be alert I like say hello connect. Yes, right? 

So I could attest to the fact because this didn't come out of nowhere Like I could attest the fact you do actually respond to your LinkedIn DMs. You do have conversations. You are in person There's not some automation running it That is how all this started. Yeah. 

Oh, yeah, yeah, I did exactly that and then you are you are my put-class now There 

we go Hannah, thank you so much for joining me appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you very much. He did Thanks so much for listening. We hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as we did 

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